Podcasts

00:00:00
Pamm Meyers
Hello everyone. Welcome to Three Essential Questions, New Mexico's business and nonprofit podcast. I am your host Pam Meyers and I'm here with my wonderful co-host, the fabulous Erica Yokum. Uh our guest today is Amanda Davidson. Amanda is a licensed marriage and family therapist and the founder and CEO of the Family Connection, a thriving mental health and counseling practice serving New Mexico communities. With over two decades of experience in therapy and leadership, Amanda has grown the family connection into a compassionate client centered organization that helps individuals, couples, and families navigate life's most challenging moments with dignity, resilience, and hope. That sounds that's sounds like I'm really excited to have this conversation with you, Amanda. So, thanks for joining us.

Amanda Davison
Me, too. Thank you guys for such a warm welcome. I'm so excited to get to talk with you and really appreciate what you guys are doing for the community.

00:01:10
Pamm Meyers
Oh, you're welcome. Yeah, thank you. I mean, really, it's an honor. I consider it an honor to be able to be here and doing and do what we're doing. How did you talk tell us a little bit about your personal journey?

Erika Yocom
Yeah, I was gonna say 20 years. What did you start when you were 10?

Amanda Davison
Um, yeah, pretty much. Um, started maybe a little bit before then, but I think um as with most good stories, it usually comes from lived experience, right? And so I didn't necessarily um growing up in New Mexico, there's just a lot of generational trauma. And growing up in New Mexico, I didn't have necessarily the best upbringing. And it's not because my parents didn't care or it's not because they weren't, you know, good. It's because there was just a lot of trauma and they hadn't dealt with their trauma. and that trauma passed on and so I just didn't necessarily grow up in the best of environments and you know had some exposure to mental health services um early in my life and what I saw was it was really great for my mom. It really changed things around for who she was and how she showed up but some of the ethics and some of the ways that was handled didn't necessarily set me up for success in that. And so while I initially fought going that route for the first little bit, um, as luck has it or fate has it, um, or faith has it, you kind of end up in the place that what you've gone through can actually help you become a light for someone else. And that's really what became my mission and starting that out is really going through and saying, "Okay, this didn't work for me." And so, how do I create systems? How do I create therapy? at first was really what I focused on. That worked for people who would have been like me and people like me who really needed that support. And then from there it worked to kind of change that from growing up and working in an a behavioral health organization. How do we make that more healthy and how do we change that for the better? And how do we create that in a business sustainable way? Right? and and it's just kind of grown um with each layer of learning how to, you know, hopefully pave the path for those that come behind me to have different options and availabilities and and really be able to set New Mexico up to not really struggle in the same ways we do with so many generational things that follow one right after the other.

00:03:47
Erika Yocom
That's a that's a big thing. That's something that um I'm kind of dealing with right now in my own family, but it is so hard sometimes to see that it's generational. Like it's not the same thing. But money literacy for one thing, like in my family, there was no such thing, right? I mean, my mom's idea of taking care of things was kiting checks, which I didn't know what she was doing until I was, you know, much much older. But I remember, you know, writing a check and driving to a different bank and cashing it and, you know, and all the things the machination she did to keep everything going. And I thought that was like how you did things, right? Like that was the normal thing. So I'm having to unlearn that kind that behavior and the mentality behind that behavior because it's if you can't figure out the if you don't see the mentality behind the behavior, you can't really change the behavior. It's my understanding, right? You have to understand what's where it's coming from before you can actually make changes. So, yeah.

Amanda Davidson
You have to be able to name it to tame it, right? And understand that so if we can't really understand it and we can't name it as wait, this doesn't serve me anymore, then we just keep doing it because, you know, that's what we know to do, and then learning something different can be really hard. And when we grow up in families, whether it's, you know, coming from impoverished backgrounds and really recognizing we didn't have anything, right? Like that's why, you know, you want to make food last, well, you buy as much processed food as humanly possible because the food lasts. Like, have you not seen how long, right? Pop-Tarts can stay on the shelf, right? Like that's sustainability, right? Without realizing like.. I'm realizing that That's long-term strategy.

00:05:47
Erika Yocom
Yeah, exactly. For me, it was like um margarine. I will never eat margarine again. That was like as a child, I remember swearing that to myself that I would never drink powdered milk or eat margarine when I was a grown-up, right? So now I'm a grownup and I'm like yeah still to you know that because that was you know yeah it's that minor traumas of course but I remember those as a kid. I just remember remember thinking that stuff isn't melting in the pan because it's not real you know melted margarine smells and tastes like plastic.

Amanda Davidson
I just love that you were a trends setter from early on.

Erika Yocom
Yeah. But you're right. You have to I like that. Name it to tame it. That's a great phrase.

00:06:43
Pamm Meyers
I like what have been some challenges that you've had in, you know, to developing your company?

Amanda Davidson
Yeah. I think there's been a lot of different challenges, right? So, I think one of the challenge we talk about is just the challenge of bringing me to the table, right? Like I think like, you know, I don't come to the table necessarily polished and pressed and having all these things. I have these other things that make me who I am. And so learning how to recognize, oh, you know, Amanda, when you just stuff things in and you don't actually share things, that's actually not very helpful, right? Like that's really like you think that you're being really kind because you've learned how to be kind and quiet, but now you're just resentful, which makes you ugly, right? And learning how to recognize that or learning how to understand, you know, feminine energy, right? And really like I think that was a big um you know battle that I had growing up because I grew up with this idea that women are supposed to be you know barefoot pregnant in the kitchen, right? And so here I was like with dreams and aspirations and you know provisions that >> were not necessarily that. And so it was always this like well if my place isn't there then where is my place? Where is my place? How do I show up? And I don't really like how like in general the I don't feel like I can show up in that very aggressive, assertive, like, you know, traditional male place. So, how do I do that and still have a voice? And I feel like a lot of the trials were trying to figure out what it meant to have a voice, but not just a voice, but learning how to find my voice, right?. And I think that's still a journey I'm on. I'm better than I was, but definitely um a big learning curve in terms of what I brought to the business and what made being in the business for 20 years, it's been 21 years now, so unique is that I really didn't have a lot of other female CEO entrepreneurs that I was watching to go, okay, I've seen this person, this is how we emulate that. And so a lot of it was kind of figuring it out along the way, which came with some cuts, bruises, bumps, some wins, some scares.

00:09:11
Erika Yocom
Representation is so important, right? Like like you said, having those >> now you can be a representative of what that looks like for the next generation because people can see you and see the success and how you handled it and how you're showing up and your voice. So that's important for people to younger people to see and and like you said have somebody to emulate or reach out to and say "how did you do that?".

Amanda Davidson
And I think business so often was so cutthroat, right? Like I think there was this idea that it was like this eat or be like you know it's me or you, one of us is surviving kind of thing. And I think I just naturally came from such a place of collaboration that it took a long little while to get to that place where I'm like, I want you to win. I and I I plan to win too. Like I'm not trying to lose and we can both win together and that can be great. And I think...

Erika Yocom
Abundance rather than scarcity. Absolutely.

Amanda Davidson
Yeah.

00:10:16
Erika Yocom
Yeah. That was a big one. That was I luckily when I when I started my first business, I I ran into a business coach who who very quickly turned me on to that that idea of the abundance like there there's there's enough business for everybody. I can refer people to other businesses without like feeling like I'm giving away. And I've and I have found that that doing that and sharing that abundance has actually grown my business. substantially because it's kind of like um Miracle on 34th Street, right? Like, oh, if you if you you know, I'm with Macy's, but if you go over to Bloomingdales, they've got X, Y, and Z. And everyone was like, oh my god, you can't do that. And you're like, well, no, you can because I don't have the answer for every single situation. But if you think of me when you have a question, I become a source of information for you and a source of help. I'm also a safe space to ask those questions >> and I'm I can be of more help.

00:11:18
Amanda Davidson
Yeah. And I think the other thing that I really learned about that in that same place is that, you know, that idea that business, you know, isn't personal, right? It was this like separation, right? And I was somebody and I'm somebody who operates with my heart, right? And so I could never really like bring that to terms or I was like, but it is personal for me, right? And and it's personal for me because I'm in the business of working with people and serving people and building teams of people, right? And so it's personal like people matter. And so and I really got to that place of if it's not personal then what's the point? Now personal doesn't mean that it's you know like I have to take everything to heart but it does mean that I do care about the quality of the work that I put out. I do care about being somebody that helps somebody when they're like, "Hey, where can I find this?" Yeah, go to Macy's down the street. Like, I was just there. totally has you. And that making people know like helping people to know that they matter. Like, that's something that I think is incredibly important and I've learned over and over again that when we do the right thing and we really put people first, it all kind of works out. Even if it works out differently than how I thought it might be.

00:12:42
Erika Yocom
It could take you down a totally different path, but it's a better, more honest path.

00:12:51
Pamm Meyers
I agree. Yeah. You and you come across um I mean, if you force something, you come across forced, right? I mean, it's pretty obvious. We've all talked to people like that, right? If you're organic and natural, then that comes across as well.

Amanda Davidson
And you want to I want to be somebody who's trustworthy, right? And you can't trust what's fake, right? You can only build trust on what's real. And we have to be okay being who we are really, right? Because that's the beginning of where relationships are built. And honestly, that's what business is, is relationship.

Pamm Meyers
Completely. I agree. Yeah. And so speaking of that, then how do you handle your um managing your clients? Do you see clients online or they do you have a brick and mortar where they come to you? How how do you work that or you do both?

00:13:53
Amanda Davidson
We do both. So again, we want to meet people where we are. We have providers that work in person and work in telehealth. We have providers who are telehealth. Um we're off we're trying to meet clients where they are. We have three locations because we really think that mental health should be local. Each community is different and the cultural aspects of each community is different. So we have three sites. We're in Albuquerque, uh Rio Rancho, and Los Lunes um right now. And you know the clientele of Las Lunes is often very different than the clientele of the westside of Albuquerque, which is different than the clientele of um Rio Rancho. And they should have providers that understand their community, understand the cultural context of what's happening, right? Understand and and be privy to being part of that because it's another part of who we are. And we want to be able to show up authentically and and show up as learners,

Pamm Meyers
Right?

Erika Yocom
I'm my eyebrows went up because Lunas, like nobody's down in Lunas.

00:14:57
Amanda Davidson
Oh, we've been there for years. It's so fun. Everything's on Main Street, just so you know. I got a I got adjusted to that because I would say, "Oh, we're on Main Street." And then I realized that was very not helpful because everything is on Main Street. So that is not a not a good point of reference. But if you say we're in between Albertson's and the um and the river, then everybody knew exactly where you were. So each community has their own unique

Erika Yocom
I'm picturing it in my head right now. I'm going, "Oh, okay. I know where Oh, I do know where you are. I just Yeah, I just clocked it. Okay. And wait, I'm like traveling down the down Main Street.

Amanda Davidson
Down Main Street, right?
So different.

00:15:45
Erika Yocom
So, you've been So, so you've been doing this for 21 years, correct?
Wow. That's amazing. I mean, that's tough in and of itself because, you know, starting a business, running a business, getting it past that five-year mark, you know, that type of thing. So, wow. What's your what's one of your best memories of running your business?

Amanda Davidson
You know, I think integrating my family in business. and a lot of people don't say that, but my kids grew up with me in the business, right? And so, we joke and we laugh now like when we just didn't have money, right? Like we small business like this idea that you have all this money like right like it's kind of like I can eat cake and be a size two. For a couple people that really works but for the most of us like we really have to limit our cake eating and I'm still probably not going to be a size two, right? Like that's just the reality of the life. Um and so you know we just didn't have a lot of money. So when we would take into a building, right? like Las Lunes is a great example. We took over that building, right? Well, that meant we were pulling out carpet ourselves, right? To save money and then we were painting the walls to save money and doing a lot of those kinds of things. And having my family um grow up in the business with me, like of my two girls, I have an 18-year-old and a 22-year-old, you know, and having them grow up in that and seeing the hard work of what the business was. I look back on it and I think one of the things I'm so proud of both of them is they have great work ethic and we manage to have fun no matter what we're doing. Whether we're extracting, you know, a large carpet cemetery full of an inordinate amount of cockroaches. Like I don't even know how that many lived under the carpet because it was glued to the floor. But we lived it, right? and and but we still managed to have fun and we can look back years later and laugh at the things that weren't fun but they're the things that built us that we made fun.

00:18:01
Pamm Meyers
Yeah, that's beautiful. Have you seen any trends in I guess in people's needs over the years?

Yeah, they've changed a lot. When I first started out in behavioral health, behavioral health was like you could only access behavioral health services or mental health counseling services if you had a special add-on plan, right? It's kind of like you have a vision plan like and you paid extra and you only really got a good vision plan if like your company was like really good otherwise like that was just not a thing. Um, and so access to care was very different. And so the needs of that were often very different. Getting the average person to be able to come in and to be able to afford that and put things in like budgets and um it was just very different. And now like you know we're not where we need to be but the mental health stigma has adjusted dramatically that people talk about it right. You see a lot of mental health matters and we are so proud of that. We used to go to community events, right? And we would have our little tent up there and our only purpose was to just kind of raise awareness that we weren't really these creepy weird people, like we were regular people. And so we'd put up a table and at first we would be there and they would like walk all the way around like you do on a really pesky salesperson, right? and you're like walking 10 feet out of the way to like hope that they don't catch eye contact with you because somehow like something terrible is going to happen, right? You're going to be like brought into this web to eventually >> you know by looking at you >> know, right? And everybody would say that "you're judging me right now". I'm like not like I sorry like I was actually just thinking about did I remember to take the meat out for dinner like if that was the look on my face that's what it would be telling you and I'm really not sure that I did. So I'm not sure what we're having for dinner as soon as we leave here. Could be peanut butter and jelly again but I'm killing it as a mom. I'm killing it. It's fine. Right. like I've got this...

Erika Yocom
those internal conversations. Yeah.

00:20:23
Amanda Davidson
Yeah. All these things, right? And then getting to the place where they're coming over and they're talking to us and they look forward to us every year and they're sharing what's happening in their life. And I think now, you know, what's really exciting is the trend is everybody's talking about it. It it is something that is very popular, right? I think of AI. I think of those kinds of things. Mental health. Um being a good consumer of mental health is really important to people. And so I'm all for that. And I also think one of the trends that I, you know, hope as this access continues is that people will also be um discriminate about how they access those services. Not all not all services are created equal. There's risk and you know AI can be really helpful. It's also very something that we want to be cautious of if we're using it with um some of our personal information. And so I think the trend has kind of gone to the other side of the pendulum a little bit right now and I'm hoping that it'll come in just a little bit because I worry about safety.

Erika Yocom
Yeah. That's a that's a I've said this a million. My kids have heard me say this the whole time growing up is that that we as I don't know if it's an American thing. I think it kind of is that we are not nothing's the pendulum is never here. It's always in a big and they're big swings back and forth, right? I think though with the mental health, I think at least for what I've seen is as people see other people go through it and see improvement, then they start going, well, you know, my sister had this issue and look what this therapy has done for her, so it might I'm going to go check it out. And I and it's kind of like that, right? And as more people talk about it and more people say, "Yes, I'm in therapy. Yes, I have a therapist. Yes, I'm going through it and it's really helpful for me, it de-stigmatizes it." And then people can talk about it and point to successes like, right? You know, yeah, your mom, you know, hey, it helped in ways and I saw it and and and okay, then maybe I'll try it. Those first followers, right? those people who are willing to like brave it. Um, and then also say this is a shocker. I know I tell my kids this all the time. Not everything that's portrayed on media is actually portrayed accurately. Right. So when you see therapy, right? It may not actually look like what you thought it would look like where you're laying on a couch telling your dreams, right? It's just two people talking and helping other people through it. But kind of like also kind of normalizing this is an image of it, but not everything on media shows exactly the full truth.

Do you And it's all changing. It's always changing, you know, like all the thing and now everybody's like, you know, right? And so, but because we learn as we learn and we, you know, Yeah.

00:23:36
Pamm Meyers
Do you get a many people that come in or that call that reach out and say, "Oh, I I AI told me I should do this or something or other." And um and that's why I'm...

Amanda Davidson
Yeah, we're not getting so many on the initial calls, but what we are finding particularly with our clients is they are using AI for different things. So, I'll see where um you know, and some of them can be really scary, like I'm having these thoughts, right? I'm having thoughts of wanting to wish I was no longer here. Um AI initially wasn't really well set up to handle those thoughts. And so, there unfortunately have been some completed suicides from that, particularly when euphemisms are used like coming home. Um but the AI's tactics are also getting really much better. So, I was talking with another provider who works in the hospital, right? And he had a client who, you know, he's had several clients who have come in and said, you know, I put in AI that I I I wanted to die and it immediately told me I needed to go to the hospital right away and it talked with me through this. Right? So, we're seeing um some aspects of it. We see it in relationships a lot. I see where clients are using it in relationships. Maybe they're having um a disagreement or an interpersonal tension with a friend or a a love interest, right? And they're like, "I know I'm so right. Tell me like tell me I'm right, ChatGPT." And then ChadGPT can say, "I can see why you would feel this way. And have you considered this? And have you considered this response?" And so they use it to kind of help support them to show up better as a partner than just as emotional and raw.

00:25:35
Pamm Meyers
It's interesting. We were just having that conversation about how um we use AI in business, but it's it's interesting to see how people are using
it for so many different things like for relationships, right?

Amanda Davidson
I tease my husband. My husband I have a funny story. We got one of those above ground pools, right? And so he was using ChatGPT for like the chemical setup and like leveling it out and it was giving him measurements, right? And then all of a sudden and he uses it for recipes, right? So then he started using it for recipes and then he'd take pictures of his recipe and send it to ChatGPT and Chad PT would tell him chef's kiss. And so my husband is like over the moon walking around with so much pride. ChatGPT said chef's kiss. I did such a great job. Right. And so I'm like, all right. I hadn't thought about using it that way either. Like, but look at you throw your own parade. Like, I'm so proud.

Erika Yocom
That's great, Amanda. I'm sure that people we and we Pam and I were we were just talking about this. I'm sure that when so when the Uber nerds got together and came up with the whole idea of AI, they weren't thinking that people were going to say, "Hey, chat GPT. I'm really down." And I think, you know, I'm ready to be done with my life. And the computer's like, you know, I could see the little spinning thing going, "What the hell do I do with that?" Right? And so they had to but they quickly realized that people are going to put any can put anything in there. And so they had to build in those those guidelines of these are the things to look out for and then tell them to go to the hospital instead of going, "Yeah, I can see how you would feel that way. Hey, here's some ideas, you know.

00:27:28
Amanda Davidson
Yeah. Definitely was like, um, sorry you're feeling that way. And they didn't do anything with it. And now it's like it's evolving, right? And I think that's evolving of like business just like technology. Businesses have to be evolving. People have to be evolving because we're either growing or we were becoming stale. And I think AI is new and it's definitely, you know, evolving relatively quick. But I think that that is just the same way it is for business. How we do business this year honestly was different than the things we were focusing on a couple years ago than the things we were focusing on a couple years before that. Um, and so our job is to really like my job as CEO is to be able to look ahead at what the trends are to walk my team and my clients through that so that we've gone through it and we're ready to support them in it versus being in it with them.

00:28:31
Erika Yocom
Right. Right. Well, then I'm going to ask you to put on your prognostication cap and say what what what's something what's a trend a for forward thinking trend that you're keeping an eye on right now for your business.

Amanda Davidson
Yeah. I think that business um in general has really condensed. I think if you look at most of the markets where you used to have 10 family dentists, right? and the 10 family dentists would all kind of they had their own book of business, but but everybody was kind of their own entity. I think if you look at it, the market's really two dental practices, for example, right? They may have separate names, but the actual running behind the scenes, they're part of two major conglomerates, right? And so I think that business, for example, is really condensing. And so we've been preparing for how do we keep things local and how do we how do we keep the heart of what's really important to us with people systematize the what we do so that we can have the same global purchasing and bargaining power and how do we be a market disruptor that allows us to meet clients where they are like but still be local. And so for us that means that we're franchising. And so we're franchising what we do. So we can say this is how we do it. Here's how you run the business. Here's how we help serve the clients. But we can do it in a way that keeps things local, creates ownership, creates job opportunities because it's not helpful for one person to own 500 places, right? I'd rather 500 people own and really invest their heart into it, but then they don't have to struggle with the same things because we're we're learning together in a system that goes, we know this works. Here's what you want to look at for your margins. Here's what you want to look at when here are the trends. Here's what you want to look at to be able to serve clients. Here's some, you know, new therapeutic techniques that we're are really validating. And so, again, we're better together, right?

Pamm Meyers
And you're building your building and supporting community at the same time, which is wonderful to say.

Amanda Davidson
Exactly. And building and supporting ownership, right? Because that's important. And then everybody has a voice, but we also give ourselves a competitive edge to go against the "McD's" of therapy or however you want to kind of say that, right? Idea of this is how to be.

00:31:10
Pamm Meyers
Amanda, what do you hope our listeners take away from this interview today?

Amanda Davidson
You know, I think I hope that they one would be um just encouraged that talking with a counselor is just like talking with uh you know, somebody that you could trust and that you could bring all of um your whole self to and that you're not expected to be compartmentalized from that and you can bring your whole self. And then that safe space would help them grow to be able to feel more confident. bringing their whole self to other interactions and other relationships and changes. And I think the other thing when we talk about business and we talk about things changing is to kind of recognize change isn't always bad and to have courage to take some of those steps forward.

00:32:20
Erika Yocom
Very good. Yeah. I'm going to put up your website here. So, it's tfc.health and folks can find out they can contact you through there and find out more information and all that.

Pamm Meyers
You can Google Amanda Davidson and get find her through there. You can Google the family connection. So, there's a number of different ways that you can reach out.

Amanda Davidson
We're on social media. So, look us up on Instagram, Facebook. We haven't got as cool to be on uh Tik Tok yet. I know that's probably something we need to do. We're just not quite there yet. Um you can look us up on the older, as my kids say, the older people social medias. They tease me that I'm not on.

Erika Yocom
I know. I know. I old people book. Yeah, I get it. I get it.

Amanda Davidson
I think the last thing I was just going to say is I think that the biggest thing I would want the other thing is just that people would know that um we keep people at the forefront and the people we serve, the people we work with and the people who trust us, they they are what matters and we hope to you know if you're ever in need of those services or a place that feels like home for work like we want to be a soft landing space that can help people when they need us.

Pamm Meyers
Very nice. Very nice. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you so much, Amanda, for being a guest on the program today.

Amanda Davidson
Thank you. It was so fun talking with you guys. I feel like we could just have coffee and chat all day.

Pamm Meyers
I think so.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you so much uh again for being a guest. Thanks everyone for listening. Thank you to Audivita for being a sponsor. Uh, and if you would like to have your business or nonprofit uh on two on three essential questions podcast, you can sign up on the big orange calendar link on twofflowerproductions.com. Thanks everybody for listening.